Wyee West Paper Subdivision

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The Wyee West Paper Subdivision consists of 199 residential lots that are owned by more than 140 landowners.

While much of the land has been rezoned to allow for residential development, the land cannot be developed because it is not serviced with the necessary infrastructure such as roads, drainage, water, sewer and electricity.

Thank you to everyone who has provided feedback so far, Council is looking to work with local landowners to explore options for the future of the paper subdivision.


The Wyee West Paper Subdivision consists of 199 residential lots that are owned by more than 140 landowners.

While much of the land has been rezoned to allow for residential development, the land cannot be developed because it is not serviced with the necessary infrastructure such as roads, drainage, water, sewer and electricity.

Thank you to everyone who has provided feedback so far, Council is looking to work with local landowners to explore options for the future of the paper subdivision.

Need to know some additional or specific information about the project? Ask the project team a question here.

Any general project questions and comments will be responded to publicly, however if you have any questions that are about individual properties, including costs and services/utilities, we will respond privately.

You can also submit suggestions for the upcoming fact and information sheets to assist landowners with topics of interest to the paper subdivision project. 





Ask the team

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    Hi, I'm considering buying land in the Bushell's Ridge/ Tullokan Rd section west of Gorokan Rd, but when I look at the sewerage rollout maps, this area is not included. This makes me wonder if this area is included in other infrastructure plans. Could you please direct me to more information?

    hakeae asked 2 months ago

    The water and sewer plans for the Wyee West Paper Subdivision have been included as part of the Development Plan documentation. We have been working with Hunter Water to develop these plans and would like to engage with landowners to discuss the detailed engineering designs and cost estimates once the COVID-19 social distancing measures have been lifted. This infrastructure will only be delivered following a successful ballot for the construction of all services. We're anticipating that this ballot will be held early-mid 2021.

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    Hi again, I thought we were going to get regular updates on what’s happening with subdivision?🤔 were we not supposed to receive something in the post,I’m sure if it was a bill the council would be quick to send that out,it seems to me that the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing in that office,and don’t forget we the rate papers are paying for these incompetent people ,like really how hard is it to treat the people that are paying you’re wages with a bit of respect

    Sinead7740 asked 3 months ago

    Thank you for your question and staying in contact. A quarterly update is underway for Q1 Jan-Mar 2020. We have experienced some unforeseen changes to Council in response to the global coronavirus pandemic over the last few weeks and have experienced some minor delays for the Newsletter. It will be available soon and we will notify you when it is listed to download. I apologise for any inconvenience caused. 

     Yours sincerely, 

     Karen

    _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

    Hi Sinead, 

    I just wanted to let you know the newsletter update is now available online. A hard copy is also on the way to landowners. 

    Yours sincerely, 

    Karen

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    So can you tell me what exactly did the landowners that were represented us contribute to the meeting?were they all present? ,what questions did they ask?did they query any of the information given out?

    Sinead7740 asked 4 months ago

    Hi Sinead,

    Thank you for your question. The Community Reference Group is made up of 12 members, three onsite landowners, three offsite landowners, three Councillors and three Council staff.  Of the six landowner representatives, four were present at the last meeting on 13 February.  

    The representatives actively participated in all discussions and raised points of concern or issues felt by other landowners. These included the period of time since the six first dwelling inspections had been completed and no further contact from Council; the changes in Council staff and the continuity of information; the bushfire risk and avenues for mitigating and managing this risk; the amount of time the development planning process has taken; the draft engineering plans review, financing and opportunities for sustainable options; discussing the needs and wants across the differing landowner groups; the next steps and timeframes and discussion about communication with landowner groups and how more regular communication was supported and how that communication should be received. 

    If you would like something to be raised about the paper subdivision with the reference group or if you would like any further information about the project, please let me know.

    Kind regards, 

    Karen

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    Am where are our regular updates on what’s happening in the subdivision ?its been awhile ,isn’t communication supposed to be the key ,also can you tell us what block number do council own in this paper subdivision .

    Sinead7740 asked 5 months ago

    Hi Sinead,

    The Community Reference Group will be meeting this Thursday 13 February and the meeting minutes and project update will be posted on Monday 17 February, if not before. Following this meeting and update, a project newsletter will be sent to all landowners in March. The last update was posted online in December under the News Tab and the most recent newsletter was distributed in August, however we appreciate your request for more regular updates and we will endeavour to keep the landowners more informed, even if it is to let you know we are still working through the complex design process.

    As mentioned, some aspects of the infrastructure design have proved more complex than we anticipated, which is why this work has taken longer than expected. At the moment, we are consolidating the information from reports recently received including the engineering detailed design for roads and infrastructure, integration opportunities with Radcliffe Estate, bushfire and biodiversity.

    We are continuing to work on detailed design concepts and accurate costings which will then allow Council to investigate possible funding assistance for the works required.

    For more detail on the above information please review the meeting minutes and project update to be posted this coming Monday. If you would like information on a specific topic, please let us know.

    Council owns one lot in the paper subdivision, 18 Waropara Road, Lot No. 216.

    Thank you for your question. We will also be updating our FAQs on this project site to reflect the questions raised in this forum to ensure landowners have easy access to this information.

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    Who is on the project team?also how many blocks of land do the council own in the paper subdivision?

    Sinead7740 asked 7 months ago

    The landowner reference group comprised 6 landowners as well as 3 council staff members and 3 elected councillors (Cr Belcher, Cr Gilbert and Cr Jones).

    A number of other staff are involved in a project steering group.  In 2019, most of the work on this project was done by consultants working on the engineering design and servicing strategies for roads and infrastructure.

    Council owns one 557m2 lot within the paper subdivision.


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    Hi Team, I'm a resident at Wyee, and your plan says that you are consulting with landowners and developers. I'm concerned that the committee members are not representing the varying perspectives of this community. Is it possible to please elect some additional members? Send out a letter and ask for re-election. Nobody in the neighbourhood, and non-residents I speak to as well do not know anything about these people, or how to communicate their desires. My main priority (and the priority of a number of other residents I've spoken with) is to seek government grants to get the cost of development to an absolute minimum. Could you please advise the best way to go about this? Lastly can you please advise when the next council meeting is, and can we get the minutes of the meeting made public? Transparency will allow us to know what is being raised in the meetings and what is being discussed (e.g. is funding a priority?). Thank you for your time, Best Regards

    Tara asked 7 months ago

    As mentioned in the response to the previous question, the landowner reference group has not met regularly since 2018 (so they are not to blame for a lack of consultation!)

    The members of the group included 3 resident and 3 non-resident landowners who were named in our December 2018 newsletter (available on this web site).

    Seeking government grants and/or subsidies is still very much on the agenda, however the time to do this will be once the engineering plans (which are close to being finalised) are ready and a quantity surveyor has prepared costings.

    A number of Council staff are involved in an internal steering group for this project and while much of the discussion has been of a technical nature, we will discuss how best to share this information with landowners and the general public.

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    All these people that are supposed to be representing wyee paper subdivision,what are they actually doing?and how come anyone you speak to had no idea who these people are and what they are actually doing for us ?when is there going to be a review of this?when is there going to be another vote on who represents us before we get totally done over ?and surely we could get a monthly update on what’s happening with the subdivision?

    Sinead7740 asked 7 months ago

    The landowner reference group only met on one occasion in 2019 (in April) and has not met since that time due to the project being in the engineering design phase.  It was agreed that the group would reconvene once we were in a position to discuss project costs based on completed detailed designs.

    Some aspects of the infrastructure design have proved more complex than we anticipated, which is why this work has taken longer than expected.

    Your suggestion for more regular updates is a good one, and we will endeavour to keep landowners better informed as the project progresses this year.




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    If the 199 lots,how many people own more than one lot?

    Sinead7740 asked 7 months ago

    As of January 2020, the 199 lots within the Wyee West paper subdivision were owned by a total of 144 separate landowner groups.

    119 of these landowner groups owned a single lot, while 25 owned more than one lot.

    Sixteen landowner groups owned 2 lots, six owned 3 lots, one owned 4 lots, one owned 5 lots and one owned 21 lots (although only 9 of the 21 lots are zoned for residential development with the remainder being zoned for environmental conservation).

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    Can you please advise if Council is on track for development consents, Wyee Paper Subdivision by end of 2022? How can I obtain a copy of the latest residential survey for the Wye West Paper subdivision?

    Forestville asked 9 months ago

    Thanks for posting these questions.

    Council is committed to assisting landowners to realise the development potential of the Wyee West Paper Subdivision, however there are still a number of steps before infrastructure can be built and consent granted for development of individual lots.

    We are currently working with consultants to finalise the detailed infrastructure design.  Approvals for the design are also being sought from utility providers including Hunter Water and Ausgrid.

    The next step will be to engage a quantity surveyor to accurately cost the works.

    Once we have the design and costing completed, we will assess the feasibility of the project by comparing the infrastructure costs payable by each landowner with the anticipated uplift in their property value that the availability of infrastructure would provide. There may also be opportunities to seek government subsidies to assist with funding the project.

    Under the paper subdivisions legislation, a detailed development plan needs to be prepared prior to holding a landowner ballot (see FAQs on this project page titled “What is the Paper Subdivisions Legislation?” and “What is a Development Plan?”).

    We are still hopeful of conducting a landowner ballot in 2020, however this will be contingent on finalising the development plan, obtaining funding commitments from Council (along with any external assistance or subsidies), and allowing sufficient time to consult with landowners about the proposed plan.

    Should the ballot be successful, approvals will still need to be sought at a Council and state level before tenders could be called for construction of the infrastructure.  Consequently, the ability to grant dwelling approvals in late 2022 represents a best-case scenario.

    Regarding your question about the latest residential survey, we surveyed landowners in April 2017 to ask whether people would like to see the paper subdivision serviced with all essential infrastructure and whether they would consider participating in a scheme that involves landowners paying for infrastructure.

    As reported in our August 2017 newsletter, 45 (or 66 per cent of respondents) said they would consider participating in a landowner-funded infrastructure scheme.  The main concern was around the ability of landowners to afford the costs associated with infrastructure, which is why we have been considering options that may allow landowners to take advantage of the equity they already have in their land at Wyee West.  This way, it may be possible to reduce or avoid the requirement for upfront payments.

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    Wyee West paper sub division doesn't have construction approval. But, recently I received a letter that there would be annual charges for waste collection from next financial year on wards. If we are not living there and vacant land, why we are supposed to pay for the waste collection?

    krismosan asked about 1 year ago

    Thanks for this question.  Council is obliged by the Local Government Act 1993 to apply the Domestic Waste Management Charge to properties where waste collection services are available - that is, along roads that our trucks service - whether or not the land is developed. 

    We recognise, however, that the paper subdivision at Wyee is a unique situation in that the land cannot be lawfully developed (due to a lack of infrastructure), yet there are a number of established residents living within the subdivision. Council believes it is in the public interest for waste services to be made available to these residents.  In light of these circumstances, we are currently reviewing the proposed application of the Domestic Waste Management Charge and will advise residents in writing of any change to the current position.

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    Who is in the reference group

    Jason deasy asked about 1 year ago

    Thanks for the question.

    The Wyee West Paper Subdivision Reference Group comprises 12 members including 3 Council staff (Senior Strategic Planner, Andrew Donald; Development Compliance Officer, Aaron Nash; and Community Engagement Officer, Karen Marples), 3 Councillors (Cr David Belcher, Cr John Gilbert and Cr Nick Jones) and 6 landowners (Joanne Cho, Kathy Docker, Martin Foster, Judex, Kathryn Kacperek and Lyndie Menken).

    The landowner representatives were selected after Council wrote to all landowners in October 2017 to invite expressions of interest from people wishing to be a part of the group.  Representatives include both residents and non-residents of the paper subdivision.







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    Hi when will voting take place for infrastructure?

    Tally asked over 1 year ago

    Thanks Tally for the question. There are a number of things that need to happen before a landowner ballot (i.e. voting) can be held.  Firstly, we need to complete detailed engineering design for the roads, drainage, water, sewerage, electricity and NBN.  Consultants are working on this at the moment, and this is expected to be completed by September this year. 

    Secondly, we need to engage quantity surveyors to prepare detailed costings of the infrastructure based on the completed designs.  This may take around a month.  The final design and costs will then feed into a draft Development Plan that also sets out how much individual landowners will be asked to contribute to infrastructure costs (including design and project management costs).  The draft Development Plan will also describe the means by which landowners can make their contributions.

    Our intention will be to consult as many of the (approximately 140) landowners as possible in relation to the draft Development Plan to give landowners the opportunity to understand how we developed the plan and what it means for them.  This consultation will likely occur either late this year (2019) or early next year (2020).  Depending on feedback and any changes we make to the Development Plan, we hope to conduct the landowner ballot prior to the end of next financial year (i.e. June 2020).



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    Hello, do you think it is fair that the paper subdivision residents will need to fork out the costs for their sewerage infrastructure themselves while the other 400 or so homes in Wyee are getting their sewerage connected from the government/hunter water funding. Would it not be reasonable to request extra funding so that the paper subdivision properties can be also included in the infrastructure costs?

    Liam asked over 1 year ago

    Thanks for the question Liam.  Council has been in discussion with Hunter Water about the community’s aspirations for infrastructure to be made available to the paper subdivision.  We will continue to liaise with HWC as we undertake detailed engineering design for this infrastructure over the next 6 months. We will certainly be seeking funding assistance for sewerage infrastructure once design and costs are known, however at this stage I cannot say what the level of funding support will be.







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    Hi, any further developments with the Saltro development on Hue Hue Road? "Early 2018" has now gone and all my attempts to contact Saltro have come to nil - phone messages remain unanswered, etc. Has Council had any advices from them?

    marcus asked over 2 years ago

    Thanks for your question Marcus.

    I can advise that Stevens Group recently entered into an arrangement with Saltro Developments which should see work resume on the Coast Central development in the near future.

    For more information, you can contact Sales Manager, Wendy Eschler, on 4965 3351. 


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    Hi, can someone please provide an update of why all work has stopped on the Coast Central development on Hue Hue Road. With stage 1 due to be released by the end of June 2018, we would have expected work to recommence by now. Who can we discuss this matter with, to get some answers/updates?

    KE asked over 2 years ago

    /Thanks for your question.

    Late in 2017 Saltro Developments advised Council that they were experiencing some delays with their Wyee development, however they expected to resolve the matter and finalise the first four stages of the subdivision in early 2018.  Council has not received any further advice from Saltro Developments at this time.

    Contact details for the developer are available at http://coastcentral.com.au

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    To the planning committee, As an ex owner of a house at Seahampton, part of LMCC, that part of the city is not forced onto sewer or water, they are totally independent from those things. Wyee paper subdivision is a very similar situation. Why is LMCC trying to force sewer and water onto this subdivision when it is not needed? There is a precedent set at Seahampton as far as water and sewerage goes, forcing residents in Wyee to dish out up to $100.000 for these services is unwarranted and unwanted, we can live clean and green with alternative ways, such as Biolet or pumpout...Your reasoning of land value increase due to sewer and water being installed is flawed, as the median price at Seahampton is $405K WITHOUT sewer and water. I implore you to find better ways to service this subdivision, without the threat of kicking us out. If your reasoning for having water mains is bush fire mitigation, this land has remained unserviced since year dot, and we have had no major problems...The main potential problem is the council owned uncleared land North of Tullokan road. Food for thought before the next meeting.

    JP asked over 2 years ago

    Hi JP, thanks for your comments.

    For historical reasons, the village of Seahampton, located west of the M1 at the George Booth Drive interchange, has remained unconnected to reticulated water and sewer.  This is far from ideal for residents, who are reliant on a costly sewer pump-out service and maintaining tanks and pumps for their drinking water supply.

    As you have suggested, the Wyee Paper Subdivision Reference Group will discuss the pros and cons of on-site sewage management at our February meeting.

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    Can council please tell me why the Saltro development has come to a standstill, and what has become of the $6 MILLION that was allocated to the waste water treatment plant in that development that has been mothballed, reportedly never to be used?

    JP asked over 2 years ago

    Hi JP

    Saltro Developments are currently experiencing some delays with their Wyee development, however they expect to resolve the matter shortly and finalise the first four stages of the subdivision in the near future.

    Regarding the second part of your question, the grant received under the Commonwealth Government’s Building Better Regional Cities program has been used to build a waste water treatment plant/water recycling facility on land near Mannering Creek on land owned by Wyee Water Pty Ltd, a private utility licensed by the NSW government .  The plant is available for treatment of wastewater from any development in the vicinity of Wyee, and was never intended solely for development on the Saltro land.


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    Who is providing sewerage services for then new Saltro estate?

    JP asked over 2 years ago

    Thanks for the question.  The first 130 lots within the “Coast Central” subdivision on Hue Hue Road (being developed by Saltro Developments) are being constructed with conventional gravity-fed reticulated sewer mains.  Eventually, the Coast Central subdivision will connect to Hunter Water’s Wyee Sewer Scheme, which is expected to be operational by December 2020.  In the meantime, Hunter Water have given Saltro Developments approval for the use of a temporary, centralised wastewater holding tank which will be serviced as needed by tanker truck.

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    Hi, Considering purchasing a lot. Can I get a sense of what you feel the costs will be per lot? and when you think infrastructure and as such building entitlements may proceed / be completed? thank you so much, Brendan

    Brendan asked about 3 years ago

    Thanks for the question Brendan.  Our initial estimates put the up-front landowner contribution at approximately $100 per square-metre.  That is, if you own a 920 square-metre lot, the cost would be $92,000.  Depending on the feedback we receive during our current consultation with landowners, we hope to undertake detailed planning and design work over the next 12-18 months to allow us to refine the costs.

    The construction of infrastructure (and hence building entitlement) will be dependent on support from the elected Council, at least 60% of landowners, and the NSW Minister for Planning.  If we clear those hurdles, we anticipate infrastructure construction could occur in 2021, and private development of the land could occur from 2022.

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    I am unable to attend the drop-in sessions as I live a long way out of the area. I am responding on behalf of my father who is a landowner but he is 93 years of age and now resides in a nursing home. It would have been nice to get more warning about these sessions. We only received the invitation in the mail one week ago. I have completed the online survey. Will this count as our vote? When does landowner consultation and voting close? Once it does close how long will it take to make a decision as to whether the process will move forward?

    BHM asked about 3 years ago

    Thanks for your questions.

    We are not counting votes as such at this stage, but rather seeking an indication from landowners as to whether they think they would participate in a development scheme in, say, 18 months to 2 years’ time.  The reason for doing the survey now is because Council would need to invest a significant amount of money into preparing detailed engineering designs and costings as well as draft legal agreements before a format ballot can be held.  We would be reluctant to commit to this path if we don’t think sufficient landowners would be willing or able to contribute.

    Council intends to respond to landowners by the end of May this year to provide a summary of feedback received from the current round of consultation and advise what happens next.

    We appreciate that a number of Wyee landowners are not local and that there was a relatively short notice period for our drop-in sessions, however you would be welcome to speak with a project officer by telephone, or arrange a time to meet at Council’s Administration Centre at Speers Point if you prefer, to discuss your father’s land.


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    Why was $6 million in public funds spent on a private development? That $6 million should have been used to connect the sewer to Wyee Heights (Not West, as you incorrectly refer to it as.

    JP asked over 3 years ago

    Thanks for the question JP. The Commonwealth grant of $6.34 million was used to construct a wastewater treatment plant near Mannering Creek at Wyee, some 600 metres from the paper subdivision (Wyee Heights).  This facility was designed with the capacity to service the paper subdivision  as well as the new subdivision on Hue Hue Road.  Since that time, Hunter Water Corporation announced their own Wyee Sewer Scheme.  This means there are two potential wastewater servicing options for the paper subdivision.  If Council proceeds with a development plan for the paper subdivision, we would choose the option that provides the best value for landowners.


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    Hi, I think that no one of those two options is realistic for most of the landowners. In my opinion the best option could be contribution payments by instalments limited by some amount per year. Is Council considering such option as well? Can't Federal or NSW Government partially fund this scheme, have Council tried option?

    Alexander asked over 3 years ago

    Thanks for your question. Allowing infrastructure contributions by instalments was considered, but Council believes it is not viable for a number of reasons. It would add to the overall project costs as Council would have to borrow more money and it also creates uncertainty regarding cost recovery for the infrastructure. Council is not equipped to provide loans to landowners, however individuals are free to seek their own finance  from a bank to make the upfront infrastructure contribution.  If a Development Plan for Wyee is prepared, it may be possible for Council to provide information to lending institutions explaining how the scheme will work.

    Regarding funding assistance from the Federal or NSW Governments, it is worth noting that a federal grant of more than $6 million went towards construction of a wastewater treatment and water recycling facility in Wyee, which could potentially be used to service the paper subdivision.  The NSW government is also helping to fund Hunter Water Corporation’s Wyee Sewer Scheme which will provide an alternative servicing option for the paper subdivision.  If we proceed with the preparation and costing of a Development Plan for the paper subdivision, Council will work with utility providers to minimise costs to landowners as much as possible.